Women in the UK take home less money than men. There are a number of "reasons". 72% of the money for work of the same value is one. The fact that more women take on part time or short-term work, and that conditions and pay for such work dramatically lag those for full-time work is another. We could talk about the ways in which society and manipulative and sometimes violent men push women into becoming primary carers for the dependents of the family. We could talk about the 94% of pregnant women who are victims of discrimination in the workplace. We could talk about glass ceilings and glass waterfalls, harrassment and prejudice. There are a lot of issues here.
The biggest discrepancy however is among older women, the pensions gap. Because women's work at home and as carers and home-makers is not recognised by the Department of Work and Pensions, only 16% are entitled to a full state pension. The result: extreme poverty among that section of the community least able to overcome it, preventable deaths from illness, hypothermia and poor nutrition and women cut of from society, unable to afford to leave their homes farther than they can walk, and resultant risk of mental illness and breakdown. I think addressing this should be a lot higher up the governments agenda.
We could talk about the ways in which society and manipulative and sometimes violent men push women into becoming primary carers for the dependents of the family.
ReplyDeleteErm, surely there is a biological component as well, men not yet being able to bear children and all that?
And if you're going to cite aggregate stats for a whole population, you'll need to take into account the women who choose, of their own free will, without any coercion or violence, nor societal pressure, to stay at home and raise the kids, rather than going back out to work. That clearly affects the average take-home pay over a working life significantly in itself.
Because women's work at home and as carers and home-makers is not recognised by the Department of Work and Pensions
No. Because women don't pay National Insurance when they aren't working, only 16% are entitled to a full state pension. But you're talking about recently retired women there, women who were born in the 1940's, when culturally, the world was a very different place. Women born today won't face the same problem, because society is now culturally very different, and women are positively encouraged to work, both by the tax and benefit systems, and by societal pressure.
Sure, we should do something about it for those people retiring now, but just citing the stat without explanation and context isn't helpful.
Where does that 94% discrimination stat come from? It sounds like garbage. Presumably it includes men acting awkwardly, being generally insensitive, and suchlike?
sure i read the 94% thing somewhere. this article suggests the number is greater than 50%. personally i know several mothers and they have all, without exception, suffered career-wise, not through their own choice, every time they have taken maternity leave.
ReplyDeletehttp://www.guardian.co.uk/gender/story/0,11812,1517642,00.html
if you're suggesting that being a full time mother, housekeeper and carer is "not working" you should try it some time. you wouldn't last five minutes.
if you're suggesting that being a full time mother, housekeeper and carer is "not working" you should try it some time. you wouldn't last five minutes.
ReplyDeleteNice straw man...
What I said was that those people not working haven't paid National Insurance in the past. I used 'not working' in the sense of not being paid, and hence not paying tax. Surely that was obvious from the context.
personally i know several mothers and they have all, without exception, suffered career-wise, not through their own choice, every time they have taken maternity leave.
Good for you. I know several mothers who have risen to the tops of their professions, in spite of taking maternity leave. Their careers haven't suffered at all. Which anecdote is better?
And you used "not being paid" in the sense of "not deserving a decent pension". My point is that the system such as it is discriminates against those (overwhelmingly women) who undertake unpaid work in the home. We should redress this don't you think?
ReplyDeleteAnd my anecdote is best because it is backed up, as you will have seen, by the Guardian article.
And you used "not being paid" in the sense of "not deserving a decent pension".
ReplyDeleteNo. The way the pension system worked is that pension entitlements came from National Insurance contributions. The rule is there to prevent the free-rider problem. And I use that term in the economic sense, before you get outraged on someone else's behalf.
My point is that the system such as it is discriminates against those (overwhelmingly women) who undertake unpaid work in the home. We should redress this don't you think?
Sure, but those women have the power to fix the problem themselves, by either going to work, or paying National Insurance voluntarily. I'm amazed that a feminist would want to enact some form of legislation that would encourage women to be kept in the home. Or is that where you think they belong?
And my anecdote is best because it is backed up, as you will have seen, by the Guardian article.
A Guardian article. Truly the highest form of authority in the land. I bow before its almighty presence. Perhaps you'd like to cite some data, rather than a couple of stories? And your link to the Groan article doesn't work, as the end is cut off.
The link works on my computer and if you go to it you'll see it is written on the basis of extensive data.
ReplyDeleteWe have a situation now, for whatever historical reason, where a large number of women, hundreds of thousands, who worked very hard throughout their lifetimes raising children, supporting working husbands and caring for the elderly are now entitled to little or no state pension and are at risk of illness and even death from malnutrition and hypothermia. That situation needs to be addressed legislatively I believe.
We have a situation now, for whatever historical reason, where a large number of women, hundreds of thousands, who worked very hard throughout their lifetimes raising children, supporting working husbands and caring for the elderly are now entitled to little or no state pension and are at risk of illness and even death from malnutrition and hypothermia. That situation needs to be addressed legislatively I believe.
ReplyDeleteThat's why I said:
'Sure, we should do something about it for those people retiring now, but just citing the stat without explanation and context isn't helpful.'
As you like
ReplyDelete